macOS Catalina 10.15 Beta

Helmut

Well-known member
#1
* Note that Catalina will not run 32bit applications.
* Check your apps (About + system report + applications + sort by the 64 bit column + check all apps with a "no" in the column).
Screenshot 2019-06-28 at 09.28.39.png
Screenshot 2019-06-28 at 09.30.27.png


* Just prior to the MacOS X update you also get a warning which shows any recent applications which are not compatible (at which stage you can still abort the update).
Screenshot 2019-06-28 at 09.32.30.png

* In my case (apart from ancient redundant stuff) the apps Audacity and Inkscape were not compatible. An Audacity 64 download was no problem, an Inkscape 64 more so. The compatible version is Inkspace 1 alpha, but Catalina won´t open it unless you fiddle with the security system prefs. I did not check the Inkspace app itself.
* Make Human does not seem to work at all; after security fiddles it crashes.
* iTunes has been deprecated / replaced by alternative apps. I have not, as yet, checked the options to record audio narration for videos.
* I have opened / tested a few C3D.jas projects and there were no problems :whistle:

* Unrelated to 3D modelling: the application 4D (a database engine) crashes.
* Note to other sado-masochistic Mac aficionados diagnosed with suicidal experimental psychopathology: Please add any of your own experiences with macOS Catalina.

* Needless to state: Make a full backup on time machine in case you decide to revert the Catalina upgrade to whatever MacOSX you are using currently. You will need to erase all data prior to the TM restore:sick::mad::devilish:
 

frank beckmann

Well-known member
#2
32bit is not the only hurdle developer have to manage. To be compatible with Catalina apps must be „Apple notarized" or won´t start at all in the future. BTW my native Inkscape version from 2015 is already 64bit - but I doubt Inkscape has a bright or any future on macOS (there´s native 1.0 beta though and I´m in contact with the team).
The amount of supplementary coding necessary Apple forced indie developer keeping their products compatible is way too much.

Cheers
Frank
 

Helmut

Well-known member
#5
* Well, Make Human 1.1.1 now seems to be operative.
* Fix the securities in the SysPrefs and hit the "allow" button on a few identical queries (4 or five in a row) on the 1st start up. Subsequent starts seem to work properly, even if the source continues to be shown as "Unknown".
 

Helmut

Well-known member
#6
* WARNING
* I have experienced major problems with restarting my Mac after the macOS 10.15 update (extremely slow, I get some nice pixely patterns and then nothing happens). Googling indicates that this is a common problem.
* Eventually, I booted in safe mode and fiddled around in terminal mode to kill the snapshots of TimeMachine.
* Looks like booting is now back to normal, but I am getting too old to spend a Sunday morning in terminal panic mode. I´ll be off to visit my previously mentioned Gothically vaulted wine bar to recover :sick:
 
#7
@frank beckmann
I know, I know, but I asked to be sure. It's not a good read, but an interesting one, by the way. I like especially that part about older apps maybe having some errors afterwards with the laconic remark that the developer should test it afterwards. We all know how much work this is.

(I asked because I'm dependent on some drivers. I'm pure lefthanded, full-tilt. While I'm able to use a mouse with the right hand fairly well (which usually is recommended and what most lefties do), but I don't have that much control over the movement was with the left. And I do use the mouse buttons accordingly (which, again, is said, that one shouldn't do it). It's a very small minority of the 10 %-minority of lefthanded people that works this way. Magic Mouse isn't a problem, but 3rd party-mouses need a driver for this. Even those that store any information like resolution and so on usually don't store this switch of buttons. So most people can use their gamer mouses without a problem, if necessary even customize them with a little help from a windows system. I can't. I need this driver. Currently I use a Razer mouse, which only has a legacy driver for mac. The actual software (still in beta) is windows only. Sooner or later I will not be able to use that or any similar mouse anymore (and there are not many mouses around that are created for lefthanded people, especially not in the gamer grade I need).



@Helmut
Somehow I have the feeling the warning is not necessary. There are very few people courageous enough to use a beta OS on their main machine, especially not if they are making a living with it. Many, many years ago I downloaded a beta of a new MS Office version that had a function which would have solved quite (see? I learn ;)) a big problem for me at the time. The installation destroyed the FAT of my harddrive. Since then I'm very careful with Betas.

You seem to test drive each beta of the OS in a very early stage (and therefore working unpayed for Apple). I'm asking myself what are your reasons? (please, don't get me wrong. It's no crit, i'm just curious. I really wouldn't dare to install this on a system I'm dependent on). Or are you using it on an older machine you don't really need for your work.
 
#8
My trusty 2008 MacPro (upgraded with USB 3.0, new-ish video card, etc.) continues to start up every day and runs Adobe CS6 like a champ under El Capitan without my having to pay blood money to Adobe for CC. I also run my 2012 MBP under El Capitan and an older iMac as well. I see no real need to upgrade OS's, but those are often famous last words and time will tell.... we'll see what tomorrow brings.
 

uncle808us

Active member
#9
My trusty 2008 MacPro (upgraded with USB 3.0, new-ish video card, etc.) continues to start up every day and runs Adobe CS6 like a champ under El Capitan without my having to pay blood money to Adobe for CC. I also run my 2012 MBP under El Capitan and an older iMac as well. I see no real need to upgrade OS's, but those are often famous last words and time will tell.... we'll see what tomorrow brings.
Mid 2009 MBP and 2012 MBP both on OS X El Capitan Ver 10.11.6 Not switching. they do what I do so I'm happy.
 

Swizl

Active member
#10
I will probably be parked at Mojave for a while. There are a bunch of 32 bit apps that I need to use. Several people where I work are still using Snow Leopard (10.6)!
 

Helmut

Well-known member
#11
* Well, I just happen to fancy experimentation and balancing on the brink of metaphoric Niagara falls.
* I must also add that those who shy away from failure and disaster miss much of the enjoyment of life. It has been my experience that I learn much more from mistakes :poop: than from successes.

* On a metaphysical (or somewhat philosophical) level: Darwinian Evolution is not a goal oriented design process. The basis of evolution is that Mother Nature is too dumb to copy genes without making errors. Many of such errors are malign and get deleted, some are neutral and get ignored and a few turn out to be useful and are passed on to further generations.
* Fortunately, failure is generally followed by extinction. Success is generally also followed by extinction, it just takes longer :devilish:. Trilobites, dinosaurs and hominids, for instance, were highly successful inventions, but all of evolution is just a lengthy one night stand :unsure:

Servus from Vienna
 
#12
Sadly this forum isn't the place to really discuss such philosophical statements. At least the one about the night stand makes a great one liner.

To make it very short: To take a risk, I have to see some possible gain for me or others, never just for the fun of it (it has some reasons I took that carthagian as a namesake, who is in the eyes of many people not more than a big failure. He wasn't. Nobody else tried, and if he had success, he'd have changed history big time (I still believe that back then was one of the key points in time where humankind went down the drain. But talking about the Roman Empire on which much of our civilisation is built, is probably even more beside the point of the forum).

At the moment I'm not quite sure if I should upgrade to Mojave before Catalina is out. High Sierra works very fine for me.
 

Jeanny

Active member
#13
Sadly this forum isn't the place to really discuss such philosophical statements. At least the one about the night stand makes a great one liner.
I'm very sorry. I wasn't thinking. Sincere thanks for the kind reminder. Point well taken.
I've deleted my first post and will delete this one as well tomorrow.

My Best
Jeanny
 
#14
Jeanny, please. No.

It's not meant like that, and your post wasn't meant in the least (like nobody else's). The emphasis was on 'really'. Because I would have liked to give a lenghty answer to Helmut. I didn't because I don't think that it belongs here. Not because it wouldn't fit, but because such thoughts involve a few more words than can be easily digested in a forum that's about 3d. Because we do have to shy away from disaster, to find a middle way between sheer stupidity and avoiding all risks, which means to stay static (it would be the end of all growth (and I know people in that group)). Me irks especially the simple fact, that very often others have to pay the price when somebody takes a risk, be that stupid driving or those bankers that gambled away billions, shoveling in the bounty for themselves and then let the (small) investors and for example in 2008 the taxpayers take the damage (and they do it again at the moment. Some president even relaxed some laws that would have been a little hindrance for the f... gamblers).

See, I have some kind of mental button in my head. If that get's pressed by accident (like a funny statement) it could end in me talking (or writing) for half an hour or so where in the end nobody understands anything anymore except that he or she isn't really interested. It's no gibberish and usually no nonsense, sometimes even profound. Most of the time it doesn't harm the unsuspecting victim. Occasionally, though, it led to irresponsible actions like throwing the job away and going to university, stop eating meat, thinking all night through instead of sleeping, reading books or at least one time in someone getting helplessly drunk. And today anyway everything should be very, very short (which often means plain wrong in the end as very complex concepts usually can't be explained in one sentence).

Your answer on the other hand was very, very short, to the point, and a nice compliment to Helmut.

Second, even if I wouldn't have liked your post, it never ever would cross my mind that actually somebody should delete a post because of me. In here I'm a simple nobody anyway. And I hate censors of all kind. Please feel free to express yourself as, when and how you want to. If I wasn't interested, I just wouldn't read it (never happened with one of your posts).

You know, it's about 3d in here, yes, but what would that forum be without the often very funny and sometimes profound comments that are beside the point?
 

Helmut

Well-known member
#15
* @Jeanny:
* Do not take Hasdrubal too seriously. He is only famous for taking pachyderms to Switzerland when he got bored with local puny(c) garden gnomes and cuckoo clocks whistling “Ceterum censeo, Carthaginem esse delendam”.
* Minor extrapolation: Do not take anybody too seriously (including yourself). My working assumption is that everybody is an idiot, at least, some of the time :mad:

* @Hasrubal:
* Yes, this is a forum dealing primarily with matters concerning 3D modelling.
* However - and to the best of my knowledge - there are no restrictions to engage in lateral thinking if this is somehow connected.

* To continue:
* Design methodology is a fundamental part of all tasks in logistics (including 3D modelling). As we humans are sentient :rolleyes: organisms (though major parts of this sentience are hardwired / instincts / deterministic in some complex way) design methodology is not some weird cloud cuckoo land for philosophical nutcases.

* I simply wanted to stress that there are alternatives to any "top-down" methodology where you start with a defined result and engage in back-engineering.
* In evolution (unless you adhere to intelligent design) there is no goal-oriented methodology, so Mother Nature uses stochastic processes.
* If you transliterate stochastics as glorified trial-and-error, as serendipity or as God is perfectly irrelevant. It is, however, a crucial philosophical choice which determines the entire systems design.

* As a practical example you only need to look at the procedures at various Institutes for Advanced Studies (in Princeton and elsewhere). Clever folks (Einstein, Gödel and many more) were given an office and the job to randomly brainstorm without any set duties. If you look at the Nobel laureates associated with such IAS you may conclude that this works. Yep, Feynmann and others don´t quite agree.
 
#16
I guess it's time someone who doesn't take himself too seriously needs to step in and seriously guide this post back on focus to its main point... which was what, exactly? Ahhh.... Living Dangerously on macOS! Well, I run a Hackintosh. So even a minor update can be seriously risky.
 

Helmut

Well-known member
#17
* There was a Catalina update, 19A501i, which I installed today, CET (Thu, Central European Time) morning.
* I can not report any problems in standard usage on an iMac27 / late 2014.
 
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Swizl

Active member
#18
I'm usually pretty adventurous with stuff like this. Hardware and software hacking. I'm not the best at it, but it can be fun. I had one of the original Bondi Blue iMacs that came out. The flyback transformer blew out on it, so the built in monitor wouldn't work. I eventually pulled all the computer hardware out and custom mounted it in a cheap PC case since an external VGA monitor would still work plugged into the side port. I should have taken pictures, but I never did. It was a pretty ugly affair, but I didn't make a lot of money back in those days to buy a new computer. I even had a hacked video card (8mb voodoo II) that plugged into the Mezzanine slot, which was suppose to be a no no from Apple. https://lowendmac.com/2018/low-end-macs-compleat-guide-to-cards-for-the-imacs-mezzanine-slot/ But the warranty was already way past coverage anyway and I really wanted to play Oni. :ROFLMAO: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oni_(video_game)

I also played around a lot with Linux back in the early days. Those were the days where to get some wireless cards working, you had to identify the exact chip manufacturer your card had and then extract a driver for it from a Windows driver. Even then a lot of wireless card chips had different revisions. So I had to install, uninstall and then reinstall multiple times. All of this was command line stuff too to get everything in the proper place and working. NDISWrapper is what it was called.

I just know that I can't experiment with my 2015 5k iMac work computer. The MacPro5,1 I have at home has an Nvidia card in it. So I can't go past High Sierra since there are no Nividia / CUDA drivers for Mojave and Catalina. Apple has supposedly dropped support for the cMP towers anyway as far as Catalina is concerned. So I'd probably have to hack the OS to even try to install it.

Thanks for the info and testing though Helmut! I'll live vicariously through you on this one.
 
#19
As soon as I stopped taking anybody seriously, life got much, much easier. Well, mine. Not that of my bosses back then. But what I always take very, very seriously are the needs and problems of other people, friend or foe.

And Helmut really put a smile on my face with his post before his last (can use it at the moment. It's raining shit).

I worked with computers for a long, long time, back in the day where every update was an experiment. I learned a lot from that, and had a miserly boss that could put Scrooge to shame. So I almost never could do anything the right way and built up the probably most complex decentral network around (years later on an IT expert phoned me. I was proud that he thought that stuff was a work of genious but he couldn't make head or tail on it (somehow they had lost my manuals). I don't have anything against experimenting as long as my existence doesn't get endangered from it. But to be honest, those of us who are more careful with such betas profit highly from those who dare to use it and report any problems. So, thank you very much, Helmut.
 

Jeanny

Active member
#20
@Hasdrubal and Helmut

You are the best and I so enjoy your informative posts as well as your wit.

My only concern was that I did something wrong and wanted to fix it. Thanks for reassuring me that wasn’t the case. I just misinterpreted your statement Hasdrubal.:oops:

I guess you could compare my character traits to those of the character ‘Rose Nylund’ (played by Betty White) years ago in the sit-com: “The Golden Girls”

I hope you agree that every Forum needs a few posts from a ditzy Granny for an occasional eye-rolling smile:rolleyes: and a good laugh.

My Best
Jeanny
 
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