Making a sword hilt from scratch with polygons

littlenemo · Jan 26, 2013

Making a sword hilt from scratch with polygons

I knew when I made this that I would probably have to replace it with something made from scratch with polygons, but I didn't know how to make such a shape so here it is.

This is the crossguard of a sword, made, as you can see from two imported PDF splines: one representing a side view, the other representing a top view. I made this shape by extruding each, and then using a boolean that makes an object where the two pieces overlap. (The cylinder in the file is a stand-in for the hole I will eventually need to put it in the middle of the crossguard.)

Naturally, when I turn this into an editable object, I get a chaos of polygons that are impossible to work with. I need to add various details and modifications to this crossguard, so I need to have an editable object that is easy to work with.

Can anyone offer any advice on how to make a shape like this from scratch?

Many thanks in advance!

Matt

podperson · Jan 26, 2013

Box modeling with subdivision is the way to go. You'll get a lighter mesh, it's easier to add detail, etc. etc.

Start with a cube, split it in half, throw away half, add symmetry, then progressively add detail.

Look at my box modeling with symmetry video tutorial for a totally different example which may help.

uncle808us · Jan 26, 2013

This may help it's a short video on how I would do it.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDZpXrdNVd4&feature=youtube_gdata_player

DarthSidious05 · Jan 26, 2013

podperson said:
Box modeling with subdivision is the way to go. You'll get a lighter mesh, it's easier to add detail, etc. etc.

Start with a cube, split it in half, throw away half, add symmetry, then progressively add detail.

Look at my box modeling with symmetry video tutorial for a totally different example which may help.

Agreed. Box Modeling has so many great things about it, that I start out 99% of objects needed with a simple four sided box made editable, then add in the subdivision modifier to smooth it out and the transform, COVER tool, scapel, weld, ring cut and other tools help do the rest from simple to complex objects. The hilt can be done, though the curved angles will require a bit more trial and error.

littlenemo · Jan 27, 2013

Wow. You people are angels. Things were moving along swimmingly, when I scaled the whole thing up to make "1" equal 1mm, and my Transform Tool disappeared. Did I scale up so much that it became microscopic? How can I rescale the tool so that I can use it again?

P.S.: I tried scaling the whole thing back down, but the Transform Tool is still missing.

P.P.S.: Okay, this is really weird. I tried copying the object and pasting it into another C3D file, but while I can use the transform tool on the other objects in the file, as soon as I select any part of the pasted object, the transform tool disappears.

frank beckmann · Jan 27, 2013

littlenemo said:
... as soon as I select any part of the pasted object, the transform tool disappears.

That is because your object has no value on the z-axis: Put in some positive value!

I noticed that already with your PDFs: why you´re modeling at this enormous scale?

Cheers
Frank

littlenemo · Jan 27, 2013

Ah! I wonder how that happened. Thank you! All of the modeling I do with Cheetah 3D is for output to Shapeways. It's convenient for me to have "1" equal 1mm. Thus the scale. Is it a problem to work in that kind of scale?

frank beckmann · Jan 27, 2013

littlenemo said:
Thus the scale. Is it a problem to work in that kind of scale?

No - when you don´t mind lots of camera maneuvers.

I usually take 1 unit=1m.
You can adjust the output scale factor @ the file preferences in Cheetah3d BTW.

Cheers
Frank

littlenemo · Jan 27, 2013

Thank you, Frank. I think I'll stick with this scale for this project, and try scaling down for the next.

frank beckmann · Jan 27, 2013

At least the result is what´s counting not so much the way to get there.

Cheers
Frank

littlenemo · Jan 27, 2013

How am I doing?

Not bad, huh? Yeah, I know you guys could have tossed this off in ten minutes, but considering that I didn't have a clue what to do just 24 hours ago, I'm pretty proud of myself.

Two problems.

1) When I add the subdivision, I get noise around the edges of the holes. I have no idea what causes that or how to fix it.

2) Because I need to print this through Shapeways, I need to make this object hollow and give it a wall that's about 2mm (in my model here, "2.0") thick. When I try to add "shell" here, chaos ensues.

Then I need to add details, like veining, to the hilt. I'm not sure how to do that at this point. Can I do something with "displacement"?

frank beckmann · Jan 27, 2013

You just need an eight sided hole (creased edges) to get round openings. And you have to reset the coord system to make proper inner extrudes.
Have a look into the file.

littlenemo · Jan 27, 2013

Thank you, Frank. I'm not sure what you mean by resetting the coord system to make proper inner extrudes. I simply do not understand how the inner extrude tool works, and none of the documentation I have seen has made it any more clear to me. I never works for me. When I tried to do a Catmull-Clark Subdivide with just eight sides, I got an octagon, not a circle. I have to do it twice before I get something that looks like a circle.

frank beckmann · Jan 27, 2013

littlenemo said:
I'm not sure what you mean by resetting the coord system to make proper inner extrudes.

See attached image. Go Menu->Tools->Coord System->Burn Transform

Cheers
Frank

littlenemo · Jan 28, 2013

Thank you, Frank. I reset the scale to 1 and was finally able to do an inner extrude.

Unfortunately, I still get an octagon when I do one Catmull-Clark subdivision, not a circle.

EDIT: Okay, I finally understood about the eight-sided circle. I select the edges of my octagon, choose "Toggle crease" from the Selection menu to make them creased, and then when I apply the Subdivision modifier, I will get a circle. So far, so good.

The problem is that the diameter of my circle is smaller than that of the original octagon. I need to have the hole be a certain diameter. When I tried to select expand the diameter afterwards, I got a terrible mess.

Also, even with the octagon, I still get some noise on the edges of my hole. I can clean the noise up without much difficulty, but I still have a hole that is too small.

Should I skip the hole for now and just add a boolean at the end of the project?

frank beckmann · Jan 28, 2013

littlenemo said:
Unfortunately, I still get an octagon when I do one Catmull-Clark subdivision, not a circle.

Try this awesome script from Hiroto on the octagon: Make Circle.js

Cheers
Frank

uncle808us · Jan 28, 2013

frank beckmann said:
Try this awesome script from Hiroto on the octagon: Make Circle.js

Cheers
Frank

It is awesome!:icon_thumbup:

littlenemo · Jan 29, 2013

Thanks to all for your help. I was working against a deadline, so I had to give up on the idea of adding decorative detail and keep it simple. Both hilts passed muster at Shapeways and are (hopefully) going in to production at this very moment. Maybe I'll post the finished products in the Gallery section when I'm done.

Hiroto's Make Circle script is amazing. I wish I had found it before sending my files off to Shapeways!

Making a sword hilt from scratch with polygons

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